On 2/14/04 my son purchase a 95 Ford Mustang from this company. The salesman Josh, started making ups stories (lying) about the car almost immediately.
When asked about the why the car wasn't clean, Josh tells him that they had sold the car to a lady who had to return it because her trade in turned out to have a salvage title on it and they didn't have a chance to detail it.
When asked if their was any kind of salvage history on the Mustang's title, since it looked like it might have been partially repainted, Josh checks the title (Kansas) and tells him the title is clean. (What Josh doesn't know is, the title is not a valid title).
A couple of weeks later, my son tries to get full coverage on the Mustang, only to be told by the insurance comany that the car had already been "Written Off" and they could not cover it.
Before he could complete his research on the car, a couple of days later the rearend locks up on him, causing the car to run off the road and flip. (fortuantely, he wasn't badly hurt, only a sprained neck)
We were finally able to order a CARFAX and were shocked at what we found:
ALERT! Severe problems (major accidents, fire, flood damage, major odometer problems or lemon history) were reported by a Department of Motor Vehicles (DMV) for this 1995 FORD MUSTANG (1FALP4045SF221621). This vehicle does NOT qualify for the CARFAX Buyback Guarantee.
CARFAX Talking CarTM
The story of this 1995 FORD MUSTANG (1FALP4045SF221621) according to our interpretation of the information reported to CARFAX:
This coupe has had 1 owner in Texas. It was originally registered by the owner for personal use.
It was severely damaged and issued a Salvage and Junk title by a DMV. It was later issued a Rebuilt title by an Oklahoma DMV, which allows for the vehicle to be repaired and returned to the road.
It has a consistent mileage history with no indication of an odometer rollback. The last odometer reading, reported on 07/06, was 66,911 miles.
It was not reported to a DMV as a Manufacturer Buyback (LEMON).
Its basic warranty has expired. You may want to discuss an extended warranty with your dealer.
Go to the Detailed Vehicle History for the complete history and a glossary of terms:
CARFAX searched more than 2.7 billion records from over 5,300 sources and found 12 record (s) for this 1995 FORD MUSTANG (1FALP4045SF221621).
Date:
Mileage Reading:
Source:
General Comments:
03/13/1995 NICB
Vehicle manufactured and shipped to original
dealer
07/01/1995 Texas
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Lake Dallas, TX
Registered as
personal vehicle
09/16/1995 41 Texas
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Lake Dallas, TX
Title #00022200048060665
Title or registration issued
First owner reported
Loan or lien reported
04/12/1997 39,417 Texas
Inspection Station
Plano, TX
Passed emissions inspection
11/04/1997 47,333 Texas
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Grand Prairie, TX
Title #29707235736081249
SALVAGE TITLE/CERTIFICATE ISSUED
11/18/1997 Texas
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Title #5736081249
JUNK TITLE/CERTIFICATE ISSUED
11/20/1997 Oklahoma
Motor Vehicle Dept.
North Miami, OK
Title #580297324022
SALVAGE TITLE/CERTIFICATE ISSUED
12/15/1997 47,457 Oklahoma
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Miami, OK
Title #580297324022
SALVAGE TITLE/CERTIFICATE ISSUED
07/06 66,911 Kansas
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Title #K0868654
Title issued
03/15 Oklahoma
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Title #580297324022
REBUILT TITLE ISSUED
01/29 Dealer Inventory
Missouri
Vehicle sold
02/14 Dealer Inventory
Missouri
Vehicle sold
In addition we found out this car had 2 recalls on it that had never been repaired. One being the parking brake, which is most likely the cause of the accident.
Armed with this information My son and I confront the Dealer:
03/19/04 10:48 A.M. - Dennis and mom enter Joplin Credit Cars.
Dennis states to salesman, Josh, I need to speak with the Manger.
Josh says, He's right in there, go on in.
Upon entering the manager's Office, he greets us and asks, What can I do for you?
Dennis begins to explain that he has discovered that the 95 Mustang he purchased from them, had a salvage title on it and believed he had been lied to by the salesman when he had purchased the car. He went on to state that he and Josh had discussed the issue of a possible salvage tile and after Josh had checked on it, he had informed Dennis that it was not a salvage title.
After explaining all of this, the manager asks Dennis, Why haven't you contacted me before now?
Josh had been standing outside the door listening in, and poked his head in the door and stated, Because he wrecked the car.
The manager says, Oh! I see.
Dennis responds, That's not the reason! He becomes visibly agitated and continues to explain that he had been told that the car had been written off by his insurance company when he tried to get full coverage a few days before the accident.
Josh interrupts and states, I told you the car had a salvage title when we were...
Dennis says, NO! You did not. You told me just the opposite. IF you remember I asked you if there was a salvage title on it, and you asked me if I would still be interested if it did...
Yeah, and you said you would buy it anyway, says Josh.
Dennis denies, NO WAY! I told you I wouldn't buy it
The manager jumps in and says, I remember now. I heard him tell you it had a salvage title.
About this time the office girl, Rebecca, comes in with the title in hand. She holds up the title in question and states, Here's the title, and it isn't.
During all of this, the manager had been viewing the items in a folder Dennis had given him. He takes notice of the rough draft of the complaint to the Attorney General Office. He asked if he could make a copy of it. I told him, I would rather you didn't because it's only a rough draft and it's in no way relevant at this point. However, there was no attempt made to stop him from reading it or skimming over it, would be a better description of what he did.
At this time, I thought it would be a good idea for me to speak up. I asked, May I say something? I turned toward Rebecca and asked, What state is that title from? Is it Kansas? She looked at it and shook her head and said, Yes.
Well that explains why they told you it didn't have a salvage title, I said to Dennis. I turned to the manager and explained to him that it was an invalid title since there had been another title issued eight months after that one in Oklahoma. The Oklahoma title was a rebuilt title since it had a salvage title previously in Oklahoma. I pulled out the Car Fax he had glanced at earlier and showed the manager the title history of the Mustang. I asked, Doesn't a car dealer check the title of a car before they take it in on trade?'
The manager answered, No, we don't
After carefully reviewing the CarFax, the manager turns to Dennis and asks, What do you want us to do?
Dennis tells him, I don't want this car, or pay for it.
The manager asks, Why didn't you notify me sooner?'
Dennis again tries to explain how and when he got the information and that he wanted to check with an attorney to find out what his rights were before confronting them.
The manager again states, Well, all you needed to do was pick up a phone and call.
I reexplained what Dennis just told him and after the accident Dennis was very upset because it was only a stroke of fate that he didn't have his 2 month old son in the car with him the day of the accident. I also explained that he didn't have the CarFax until after the accident so he didn't know for sure until I ordered the report.
The manager continued to go on about the fact that Dennis had signed all the paperwork for the car and was legally bound to the contract, showing him the back of the title where he had signed and pointing out that they had bought it from Joplin Ford (their parent company).
Dennis then asked, What about the recalls on the car? I found out there was a recall on the parking break, that is what might have cause the accident.
It appeared that the manager didn't quite know what to say. I took the opportunity to ask, Shouldn't the dealer repair a known recall item before reselling the car?
The manger responds, We aren't a Ford dealership, so we would have no way of knowing. If we were then maybe. The car hasn't been to a Ford dealer.
At this point I couldn't help laughing out loud at all their ridiculous lies and I say, You bought the car from Joplin Ford and then you had it inspected by Neosho Ford. The manger turned to the office girl and she confirmed, She's right, Neosho Ford did the inspection.
The manager seem to change his tune for a moment but again asked, Why didn't you call before now. You didn't need to come in here all forceful with an attitude.
Dennis starts to explain that he didn't have an attitude until Josh called him a liar but was interrupted by the manager when he said, You know we are a big corporation, and you don't want to go about this legally. We could drag this out for a long time and end up costing you more than the car.
Dennis explains, That's why I am here now. I don't want to have to drag this through court, I want this taken care of.
The manager again tried to intimidate us, You know your balls are nailed to the wall. We have you signature on all the documents.
I interjected, Yes, but nowhere on those documents does it state that the car has a salvage or rebuilt title because you didn't know. Not informing him of that makes the sale voidable. That Kansas title should be void. How would he have ever been able to get a title to the vehicle? By the way, can we have a copy of that title/
The manager looks at Rebecca, chuckles and says, I don't know, you won't let me have a copy of the this, pointing to the complaint form.
I answer by saying, Well if you really want a copy you can have it but it's not even accurate now because of what we learned here today. If it comes down to it, and we do have to send it I 'll be sure to send you a copy.
He Says, OK, and hands the title to Rebecca to copy.
Dennis then asks, Can you tell me who the woman was that bought the car before me and returned it that Josh told me about.
The manager looks at Dennis with a puzzled look on his face and asks, What woman? Then looks at Josh.
Dennis explains, Josh told me a story about a woman who bought the car but had to return it when it was found out her trade in had a salvage title.
Josh denies this saying, I don't know what your talking about.'
The manager chimes in, You're the only one who has bought that car.
I back up what Dennis said, Yeah, Dennis told me about it just a couple of days after he bought the car.
OK, just more of your crap, Dennis mutters.
The manager then turns to us and says, I will check with the main office and see what they want to do.
Dennis asks, How long will that take. I mean, I don't want to have to wait forever for you to get an answer. Like I said, I want this thing done with.
The manager responded, Call me Monday and I should know something. If we void the contract, will that be good enough, or a different car?
Actually, I was looking to get my money back. I don't need another car since the finance company on my truck has agreed to lower my payments and I have decided to keep it. I need the money back to help pay the medical bills from the accident.
The office girl brings back the title and gives it to me. The manager asks if he can have a copy of the CarFax. Dennis tells him, Go ahead and keep that one, I have another copy at home
Dennis agrees to call the manager on Monday and he agrees to try to have an answer for Dennis. We leave, both amazed at how many times they tried to lie their way out of it.
I know this is long winded, but we are sending this information to the Attorney General's Office and more. A lawyer would cost us more than the price of the car to fight this. The Dealer offered to take the car back and cancel the sales contract but not return the $1250 down payment or any payments made. Any one out there got any suggestions.
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