On 9/17/07 we had a salesman come to our home to give us an estimate on laminate flooring for our family room and carpeting for our bedroom. His name is Barsi.
He started out by giving us the song and dance routine, claiming that he was not like a car salesman and would give us the bottom line price for our products. He pumped up the company's reputation, their superior quality products and service. He proceeded to tell us that they NEVER used sub-contractors or day laborers.
Then we got into the type of product used, the quality and warranty. On the laminate flooring, we were told that it is the top of the line, only sold through Empire, scratch resistant, waterproof and resistant, with a 25 year warranty. He explained the testing used on the product, where they submerged the flooring in water for numerous hours and no swelling or peeling of the product occurred. We were impressed by this, and the samples he showed us looked of excellent quality. Same with the carpet.
We were looking over the color choices on the laminate, and he was pushing the Brazilian Cherry. I liked the 2 instead of 3 board look, and the less subtle graining in the floor, but we were worried it may be too dark and too red to blend with our yellow undertone oak cabinets and the gray and yellow toned kitchen flooring. The picture he showed us also looked like a red color and black color checkerboard. He assured us that it did not look anything like the picture, and that it was the most popular choice. He held up the small sample to the cabinets and to the flooring so we could compare. (As anyone with a construction background can tell you, a small 8 inch by 8 inch sample is no where large enough to determine a color match for such a large floor. Later we also found out it was the most expensive flooring they carry, hence the pushing us towards it.)
He also assured us that when they started the install, if we were unhappy with the product, to have them stop and another product would be put down instead. That and the scratch resistant, water resistant qualities of the product. I have dogs and a young daughter who does spill things. He assured us it would be fine, she could dump a glass of juice or water on the floor and we could leave it there for hours and it would not cause any damage or issues. That was the assurance we needed to agree to the sale.
He then measured our rooms and gave us our quote. $5,950.00 for 517 sq. Ft.in laminate, and $1,794.00 for 470 sq. Foot of carpet. I was shocked to say the least!!! The price of the laminate was extremely high, in my opinion. However they had the financing options we were looking for, and as my husband does not have time to install, them being able to install the product was a benefit. We decided to only go with the laminate for now and do the carpet later to keep the cost down. We agreed on the pricing, and he checked with the office on the financing.
We were only approved for $5,000.00. So, he asked if we could put the remainder on a credit card. We said no. So we were ready to do nothing at this point, which is where I wish it was left! BUT... He dropped $950.00 off the price so we could do the flooring. We agreed, and scheduled the floor install for 9/21/07.
The installers showed up and I explained to them what the salesman had told us. They informed us that they were subcontractors, (1st LIE by Barsi) that only worked for Empire, but they had their own liability insurance, so they could not stop the install; they had to complete the job because of the liability of leaving the concrete exposed (2nd LIE by Barsi). They also told us that Empire would not replace the product with a different color because they do not honor verbal contracts only written, so anything our salesman agreed to verbally, would be basically null and void (3rd LIE by Barsi). They finished the install by using quarter round edging along my baseboards.
I was concerned because the ends were angled and they did not look right against the edges of the door casings. They told us that was the product used and the install instructions by Empire that they had to follow. I signed off on the job, because they cannot leave until I do so. They handed me a brochure from the boxes of flooring that had the warranted information on it. The product name is Quick Step.
My husband and I were not happy and so the next day, 9/22/07, when I looked at the floor and how it did not match color wise with the cabinets, and was checker board looking, just as we feared, I called Barsi and explained the situation. He told me to call the 800 number and they would resolve my issue. I called Empire and left word that I wanted a color change as per our salesman's instructions. I got a confirmation number and everything.
This was on a Saturday, so they told me I would probably not get a return call until the following week. The sales manager Melvin returned my call, which surprised me because of it being a weekend. I explained the situation to him and told him I needed to verify the color with my husband and I would call them back the next day on 9/23/07.
On 9/23/07 I called and left a message for Melvin that yes we wanted to change the color out and fix the baseboard issue. We wanted them to bring samples so we could choose something that had the 2 board not 3 board look with subtle graining and more of a honey tone. I received a call back from Melvin on 9/25/07; he left a message with his office number and extension, as I was on the other line. I called him back through the customer service and gave them his extension where they put me through to him and we discussed the issue with my floor. He explained that it would have been better to stop the installers and they could then replace the floor because they could return the unopened boxes, but that it would be hard to do now as the floor is used, but he understood the installers liability issue.
He said that he needed to go up the ladder of command to the GM, and he was out of town until Thursday. He would go over this with him when he returned and get back to me. I did not hear a word.
Then on 9/29/07 I called back and found out the GM had just returned, and left another message for Melvin through the customer service line. Not a word. On 10/2/07 I called and left a message through customer service and got a confirmation number. The customer service person assured me they left a detailed message for Melvin to get back to me right away. Nothing.
On 10/3/07 I called the office number and used Melvin's extension to leave him a direct message where I threatened a lawyer's involvement if he did not return my call and get this new floor installed by weeks end. He finally called me back and scheduled an inspection with him, the GM and the installation manager on the next day, 10/4/07, at 3 P.M. Finally, I thought, progress!
10/4/07, Melvin showed up by himself, over 20 minutes late! My husband and I went over the issues with him and told him what we wanted. He told me the installers said that I said it looked fine, and that we had signed off and should have put on the sign off sheet the issues. I explained that I had gotten two conflicting stories from Barsi and the installers. I had to sign off so they could leave, and I did not want the problems I had to reflect on the installers because it was not their fault that the product was not what would work in our home, or that the baseboards and quarter rounds were installed per Empires instruction, and looked awful. He went outside to call someone higher up.
When he returned inside, he was accompanied by Barsi. I can only assume that he contacted him and no one else! Then he proceeded to tell me that the floor was installed per their contract and that they would not replace it. He said there was an option of us having the baseboards that match the floor installed instead of the quarter rounds, and that we could remove our old baseboards and they could replace the end pieces of laminate and install the matching baseboards, but it would cost me for the materials and labor. I absolutely refused to pay a dime more and told him so. I also pointed out the lies that Barsi told us to him and Melvin, including the fact that the baseboard option was never even offered to us! Melvin said that he would see if he could get the materials and labor for the baseboards at no cost for us and he would get back to me on 10/5/07. I told him I needed an answer and install before 10/8 because I was going back to work on Monday, and had company coming into town on the 12th.
Everything that needed to be moved back into the family room is in the spare bedroom where my company is to sleep, so this needed to be resolved ASAP! He said he understood, handed me a business card, and he and Barsi left. His business card has a cell phone number on it and his title: Assistant Sales Manager! He is not even the Sales Manager! I was starting to feel like I was being lied to and duped again!
10/5/07 I was in the shower when my 3-1/2 year old daughter spilled a whole cup of water on the floor in the family room. She came and told me about it, and I got out of the shower and got dressed. I went in to clean up the mess (approximately 20 minutes later). I went about my business and then looked into the family room and noticed something odd about the floor. I went over and inspected the flooring. I noticed that at a seam between two boards it was starting to bubble up! The floor was only a week old! I was shocked! I pulled out my Empire file and looked at the brochure from Quick Step and it states on Section 13) Maintenance, 5th bullet point down: Wet maintenance forbidden! I was starting to get very angry.
I went online and went to Quick Step's website and found out that there are 51 dealers of the product in Orlando alone, and none of them listed was Empire! It is a parquet floor, not an engineered laminate. Also on the FAQ section about dampness it states specifically:
Avoid dampness problems
It's better to prevent dampness than to have to cure the problems afterwards so we have the following tips:
Despite the very good damp-proof characteristics of Quick-Step laminate floors, it is not recommended to install laminate parquet in damp rooms (bathroom, sauna, laundry area, etc.) In addition, you must never (not permitted) clean Quick-Step laminate floors with water. Avoid standing water and other liquids on the floor at all times.
Not clean with water! The installers told me to clean with water and a towel or to go to Home Depot or Lowes and get a laminate cleaner. AND what about the claims by Barsi about the water resistance and the testing? I was beyond angry now.
I called and left a message on Melvin's cell phone that he had better call me to schedule a removal of my floor and a full refund. I was not going to have this inappropriate flooring in my home, especially after the lies and deception. I also told him I would be contacting the BBB and Dunn & Bradstreet, along with GE Money Bank (the financing company) and this site.
I did contact GE Money Bank and spoke with a credit supervisor. They are sending me a dispute form to fill out, and when they receive it they will put a hold on our account. I made it plain that the only resolution I would accept is a removal and refund, period. He put that into his notes and said it would take 2-3 billing cycles to get my account credited back, but that I would be credited. There will be no damage to a credit report, no finance charges, late fees or any payments owed during the process either. Then I can cancel the account and reapply for financing through an actual reputable company with the product and pricing I want!
Now, if anyone from Empire wants to submit a rebuttal, feel free to submit one that is not a canned or automated response from someone with one name on the sign in and another, different name signed on the actual rebuttal. I want to hear from someone HIGH up at Corporate in Illinois. I want an actual person, with an actual number where they will respond to my call, and someone that will get the Orlando office to come remove the product and refund me by days end on 10/7/07. That is all I will accept, or I will proceed with a lawsuit.
I will post my issues with a lawyer, and I am sure I will have many plaintiffs wiling to sign on to a class action lawsuit! No more trying to resolve the issue with lies and inferior products, only removal and refunds will be acceptable. Period, end of discussion!
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