Below is the circumstance related to this Company. Choose for yourself, but this company needs to be reported to the Better Business Bureau more often. I would stay clear of Sundowner Tractor Company becuse they appear to run their prsonal life first, business activity as a second thought and good customer service: FORGET ABOUT IT!
COMPLAINT ACTIVITY REPORT Case # 38004922 Better Business Bureau Serving Eastern Oklahoma
Consumer Info: Fletcher, Keith Business Info: Sundowner Tractor
401 15th Street Rte 4 Box 2170
New Cumberland, PA 17070 Stilwell, OK 74960
7177740764 7178050267 918 696-5965
Location Involved: (Same as above)
Consumer's Original Complaint:
BBB representative,
Below, you will find a sequence of e-mails detailing as much as possible the circumstances involved that initiating my complaint to your organization. At present, I am trying to get all proper documentation with regards to this transaction. I will supply as I receive, invoice with dates from service tech who received parts shipments, communication documentaion between complaintee company and their part supplier. And credit card statements with dates of actual transactions.
Your help to resolve situation would be greatly appreciated
Thank you,
Keith
*supporting_documentation%
From: keith
Sent: Thursday, July 06 10:33 AM
To: [email protected]; [email protected]; [email protected]
Cc: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Sundowner Tractor pass off of responsibility to your corporation
Well Belarus Folks,
As you can see by the following sequence of communications, the owner of Sundowner Tractors is relinquishing their resonsibilty in this fiasco and passing the blame to your organization and myself for having expectations of communication and proper information from the machinery industry.
Now, I want to know ; is her inference that your company is informing her company untruths as to whether a part were shipped and then not reallly shipped, on two occasions. Also, that her hands are tied when dealing with your company because she can't control what your company does as being your customer. Thus leading me to beleive that your company's lack of communication is the major contributing factor causing my monetary loss, while sundowner retains the profits made from my trasaction of purchasing your product, while I suffer a monetary loss from trying to purchase you product.
What does your company have to say in this manner. I would want some answers to who is telling the truth and who is lying here. I also would like some connunication documentations, transpiring between your company and Sundowner Tractor, indicating what information was supplied to Sundowner Tractor regarding my order and when my part (s) would be shipped.
Keith
You can reach Adrian Drewitz, the CEO of Belarus International at 800-356-2336, extension 0 or by email at [email protected]
Sent: Wednesday, July 05 3:57 PM
To: [email protected]
Cc: Adrian Drewitz (Adrian Drewitz); Dennis Casper; Ray Koscinski
Subject: Re:
It is quite funny how the same set of circumstances has two totally different perspectives.
Yes I do recall, we did speak on a near daily basis a few days after my credit card numbers were taken and I was given an initial indication that the parts would be or should be in stock only to find out that items were on backorder after I received a second order of gaskets and such arrived at the service tech of my choice with no arrival of my first order including the pressure plate.
Even then, I had to contact you. You did not contact me. The reason for my near daily calls on the status of my parts was so I could keep my (business) involved people fully in the know of the situation, so we could be abreast of things and not need a contingency plan. The only flaw in the communications in these dealings was you. I asked the status the first time. You told me it was sent out on a Thursday.
When I called the next week you said that your parts supplier did not ship it on Thursday and should have sent it the following Monday and I called to confirm, you stated for the first time that it was on backorder and said you would be getting the part from another supplier. I then called more frequently only to get updates so I could keep everyone informed.
The only thing you had to provide to me, was that you can't help what was the parts suppliers fault ;and that you could not control what they do. I asked you for information on how to contact your supplier, if you could not get any information for me and that only resulted in you implying that you have some kind of dispute resolution case going on with the parts supplier and would not give me the information. The last time we spoke I asked you to get me the status of the part shipment and get me a shipment tracking number that you are only supplying me today.
What you have considered argumentative and yelling is simply me trying to know where my items that I paid YOU for are, and requesting from you that if you could not take care of me, your customer's, business and tell me what is the status of the item I paid for, then give me the number for the people or company you are blaming for the problem so I may take care of the business that you cannot.
If a suggestion is what you have to offer, than I might offer another suggestion for you to prepare a rebuttal statement for the Better Business Bureau servicing your area in Tulsa, Oklahoma. Maybe I should also talk to Belarus.
And contrary to what you may think I am not anyone with any mechanical or farm experience. I am not a mechanic and I am not a farmer. However, I do know how a business is operated and conducted.
The referral is quite funny because you were happy to take business away from them whenever I initially called you, now, because you cannot provide adequate customer service, you want to send me back to them. That is quite an easy way out for you after you caused a mess.
Keith
Original Message
From: Shelley Terrell
To: 'keith'
Cc: Adrian Drewitz (Adrian Drewitz) ; Dennis Casper ; Ray Koscinski
Sent: Wednesday, July 05 3:11 PM
Subject: RE:
Keith,
I am the lady who sold you the parts, and I own Sundowner Tractor. You have made several points. I will try to answer them in order.
As you may recall, we spoke nearly every day regarding the shipment of your pressure plate. The part, as you were "informed in an accurate fashion", was backordered. As anyone with any mechanical or farm experience knows, backorders are a common occurrence in the mechanical industry. I cannot control shipments from overseas. If your tractor broke down and you had a shipment of railroad ties ordered, perhaps you should have had a contingency plan in place to put into effect when your personal tragedy (the failure of your tractor) took place so your business could continue to run in a professional manner.
We did speak on the morning of June 22, just five hours after I found out about the death of my nephew. As I recall, I did try to answer your questions. I did try to explain that I was in contact with Belarus International regarding the backordered pressure plate and that Belarus had assured me your part would ship that day (as you can see by the attached shipping schedule, the part DID ship that day). After I told you your part was shipping that day, you became argumentive and wanted to yell at me. I did say I didn't feel like dealing with you. I was telling the truth. I didn't feel like dealing with anyone who wanted to argue. I had already told you everything I could about your order, but you still wanted to yell at me, and I was not in the mood. I am human.
You are correct. Kevin's death was not your problem. But the fact you ordered railroad ties with a broken tractor is not my problem. The fact that your part was on backorder is not my fault. The fact you failed to reschedule your railroad tie delivery when you first realized your part backordered is not my fault, nor is it my problem.
Since your original order was placed on June 12, and you had known about the backordered status of your part for ten full days (our conversation took place on June 22), I fail to see how my refusal to argue with you on June 22 caused you any extra expense. Since you had been waiting for your part for 10 days, it would seem to me that your common sense would have dictated that you should delay your shipment of railroad ties.
In answer to your question about empathy, you will receive what you gave. To help you make up for your "caused loss" I will offer a suggestion. Hopefully it will help circumvent future "caused" losses. If your equipment fails, don't bank on it being repaired by a certain date. The only thing in life you can expect is that the unexpected will happen. If you follow this rule of thumb, hopefully you will be prepared next time and not "cause" yourself any more loss.
I am glad you are satisfied with the product you received. Belarus is an excellent product.in order to protect you from any more "poor customer service", I will be happy to refer you to:
Lubiniecki welding & equipment
17071 cussewago road
Meadville, pa 16335
Owner: Chip Lubiniecki
Ph: 814-336-3553
Hope this helps!
Shelley Terrell
Sundowner Tractor
918-696-5965
Www.sundownertractor.com
Location
Date
Local Time
Activity
Harrisburg, pa, us
06/26
10:41 A.M.
Delivery
06/26
6:17 A.M.
Out for delivery
06/26
6:13 A.M.
Out for delivery
Harrisburg, pa, us
06/24
5:48 A.M.
Arrival scan
New stanton, pa, us
06/24
1:52 A.M.
Departure scan
New stanton, pa, us
06/23
10:56 P.M.
Arrival scan
Elm grove, wi, us
06/22
11:55 P.M.
Departure scan
06/22
6:32 P.M.
Origin scan
Us
06/22
5:39 P.M.
Billing information received
Tracking results provided by UPS: 07/05 1:28 P.M. Eastern Time (USA)
From: keith
Sent: Wednesday, July 05 10:43 AM
To: [email protected]; Donna State Fletche; bbb@state. Pa.Us
Subject:
To Owner of Sundowner Tractor:
This is Keith. I am the person who bought the clutch assembly parts recently. I am writing to inform that as a result of the parts shipping miscommunications. I had to spend an additional $360.00 in equipment rentals that I had not intend on spending. Had I been informed in a accurate fashion, I would have had the oppotunity to delay a shipment of railroad ties correctly in oder to use my existing piece of equipment.
When I did call and try to address the issue, I got a response of I don'y feel like dealing with you because I have a personal tragedy going on in my life. I can empathise with this fact, however, business ande personal never mix well. Possibly, business could be better ran if contingency plans were in place to put into effect when a personal tagedy takes place, therefore business can continue to run in a professional manner.
Now, because your business was not ran in a professional way because of your personal problems; you have affected my personal life by causing my funds to be spent unneccessarily on things that good have been well spent elsewhere. Do you think I will receive any empathy for my newly created personal problem?
I am satisfied with the product that was received. I am not happy with the results of my poor customer service. I would like to know what you intend to help me make up for my caused loss.
Respectfully,
Keith
Consumer's Desired Resolution:
reimbersement of $350.00 expense caused by Business owner's failure to communicate status of order accurately and/or timely.
BBB Processing
07/06 web BBB Complaint Received by BBB
07/07 shir BBB Complaint Validated by BBB Operator
07/07 Otto EMAIL Send Acknowledgement to Consumer
07/07 Otto MAIL Inform Business of Complaint
07/11 BBB MORE INFO RECEIVED FROM THE CONSUMER:
From:
To: parts@sundownertractor. ComCC: adrewitz@belarus. ComSubject: Re: 38004922Date: Thu, 6 Jul 17:23: 02 -0400
The parts are already put into the tractor at this point. They will not be returned. Returning them will not help me recoup my monetary loss that you have caused. However, I will be willing to entertain the markup profit margin that you are keeping from your sale of parts to me, not to exceed $360.51, which is what I had to pay out to RSC Rental in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania as a result of your actions and lack of timely communications.
Otherwise let this claim stay on your Better Business Bureau record for a time of no less than 36 months (three years), in which time you will not be elegible for any state contracts. The ball is in your court, Keith Fletcher Also, you have accused me of arguing, and yelling and now harassing. Please stop your attacks on my character and do the right thing.
Original Message — From: Shelley Terrell To: 'keith' ; [email protected] ; [email protected] ; [email protected] Cc: dofletcher@state. Pa.Us ; bbb@state. Pa.Us Sent: Thursday, July 06 2:04 PM
Subject: RE: 38004922
To the lady at the State of PA & the BBB State of PA, please notice my first response to your client was yesterday. He has continued to harass and threaten my business and has tried every way he can to cause me trouble. While I recognize the BBB has a valuable pla
07/11 BBB MORE INFO RECEIVED FROM THE CONSUMER: 7/2 PURCHASE VISA TRANSACTIONRENTAL SERVICE CORP NEWPORT PA DATE 06/29/06 2432300J57QVG5W4Z 7394 $360.51
Here is a copy of transaction from my bank showing amount of my and transaction date for rental service
Keith
07/11 BBB MORE INFO RECEIVED FROM THE CONSUMER:
I spoke to Adrian Drewitz, CEO of Belarus, on 07/06/06 at 4:00PM. During the course of our conversation, Mr Drewitz offered that he had checked with all his staff and concluded that the only communications that he received from Sundowner Tractor was for the placement of their order. He stated there were no other communications between Sundowner and Belarus with regards to checking the status of my order or backordered part. He stated that the first time he heard there was a problem with regards to this order on 7/05/06 @ 3:19PM as a result of Ms Terrell cc. Sent to him in a response e-mail sent by Terrell to me.
Mr. Drewitz also stated he wished that he was aware of the situation earlier because he could have and would have made arrangements to have my product shipped from one of his other locations.
07/12 BBB MORE INFO RECEIVED FROM THE CONSUMER:
Here is the remainder of e-mail from Sundowner that was cut off of last document submittal
Known sender. (Why?) Sender is in your Contacts list Learn more4:54 PM 7/06/06Shelley Terrell ([email protected]) To: "'keith'" ; [email protected]; [email protected]; rkoscinski@belarus. ComCc: dofletcher@state. Pa.Us; bbb@state. Pa.Us
Subject: RE: 38004922
To the lady at the State of PA & the BBB State of PA, please notice my first response to your client was yesterday. He has continued to harass and threaten my business and has tried every way he can to cause me trouble. While I recognize the BBB has a valuable place in customer/business relations, this customer is abusing the system to torment me. He has been in possession of his parts for over 10 days!
I am circulating a copy of his continual correspondence so you can appreciate the magnitude of his harassment. Keith, You may ship all your parts back to me freight collect and I will refund your money. If you opt to keep the parts, that is your choice. Keep them and quit harassing and trying to bully me. I am through playing your childish and foolish games and I refuse to be dragged into it any further. I do not have the time or the patience for this.
Please choose a different Belarus dealer in the future. This will be my last correspondence with you, unless you return your parts, in which case I will correspond one more time to give you a complete ref
07/12 BBB MORE INFO RECEIVED FROM THE CONSUMER:
Here is a copy of my first order dated 6/9/06, that included backordered part in question. Which is contrary to stated facts of time sequence by Sundowner Tractor business owner
PURCHASE VISA TRANSACTIONSUNDOWNER TRACTOR 918-696-5965 OK DATE 06/09/06 2426928HJWGND52H8 5999 $856.67
07/12 BBB MORE INFO RECEIVED FROM THE CONSUMER:
Here is a copy of bank statement showing my second order of gaskets that was placed on 6/12/06, which arrived before my previous first order prompting me to call Sundowner Tracor owner about missing first order and finding out for first time about backorder of clutch plate and being told false information on it's shipping status. This submittal again showing contradistion to statements of fact by Sundowner Tractor business owner"
PURCHASE VISA TRANSACTIONSUNDOWNER TRACTOR 918-696-5965 OK DATE 06/12/06 2426928HLWGND52J0 5999 $73.53
07/22 WEB BBB RECEIVE BUSINESS RESPONSE: Contact Name and Title: Shelley Terrell, owner
Contact Phone: 918-696-5965
Contact Email: [email protected]
Keith ordered parts for his tractor on late in the afternoon, Friday 6-9-06. Belarus International was closed by then so they did not even receive his order until Monday, June 12. It is Sundowner Tractor's policy to charge the customer's credit card for the item ordered before shipment. This is to prevent shipment to a customer whose credit card may be declined.
We do not have a live inventory link with our supplier; therefore we have no way of knowing if a part is in stock or not unless that supplier is open for us to call them and verify availability. If the part is not in stock, the customer is given the option of a refund, or he/she can leave the part on backorder to be shipped as soon as it becomes available. When Keith placed his order late that Friday, the supplier was closed, so I could not call to check availability. I became aware of the backordered status of the part when Keith called to check the status of his order.
Prior to his call, I assumed the order shipped. I called Belarus International and was told the part was on backorder. Ray Koscinski told me the part would probably be available within a few days. I informed Keith of the situation and offered him a refund that day. I suggested he try another supplier. He declined the refund and said to send the part when it came in. He said he didn't want to find another supplier because that would take even longer.
I told him it would not take any longer because his order had not shipped yet, and indeed another supplier might have it in stock. He again refused a refund.By Keith's own admission, he received the other items he ordered promptly. This is because those items were in stock. On the day the backordered item was to ship, I called Belarus and was told by Ray Koscinzsky that they had trouble with the pressure plate and he needed to check it before he sent it out so it would not be available to ship until Thursday, June 22.
On the morning of June 22, I did suffer a personal tragedy. My 31 year old nephew was killed on a motorcycle and left two children and a widow. I was devastated; however that did not interfere with the shipment of Keith's part. I came in to work that day just to make sure Keith's part shipped, then I was planning to leave.
I called Belarus International and was advised the part was ready to ship, but there was no UPS tracking number yet because they didn't have it boxed yet. Their freight does not leave until 3:00 pm. About that time, Mr. Fletcher called for a status. I told him I had called Belarus International and his part was shipping that day. He requested a tracking number. I told him I did not have a tracking number yet as Belarus International's shipping department hadn't printed the label yet. He started cussing at me, using the Lord's Name in vain. He yelled and cussed and used language my own husband wouldn't use in front of me.
At that time, I told him, I was sorry, but I had just endured a personal tragedy, the death of my nephew, and I was not in the mood to take a cussing from him today. I refused to take his verbal abuse and I hung up. As shown by the shipping report he pasted in his complaint, his part DID ship that day. My refusal to take his verbal abuse and his cussing did not result in slowing down the shipment of his parts. Neither did my sorrow at the loss of my nephew. Keith saw my weak moment as an opportunity to attack my professionalism and thereby get free parts.
I was NEVER told he had a shipment of railroad ties pending, and I was NEVER told he might need to rent equipment because his shipment was backordered until AFTER he received and installed his parts. Had I been told, I would have explained to him that the limit of our liability was a refund of his part and a cancellation of the backorder.
Actually, I did explain that to him when I offered him a refund. Obviously, as a retailer, we cannot be responsible for expenses incurred by our customer because of parts backordered by the manufacturer. The limit of our liability is a complete refund for a backordered part and a cancellation of the order. For a faulty part or an incorrect part, the limit our liability is a refund or an exchange.
This is INDUSTRY STANDARD! Please note, Keith's rental receipt shows he did not rent the equipment until June 29, three days AFTER the part was delivered on Monday, June 26. The mechanics in our shop can install a clutch, pressure plate and throw out bearing on a tractor of Keith's model in ten hours. Assuming the tractor was already torn down for diagnostic purposes, and so the correct parts could be ordered, BEFORE they were ordered, the only thing his mechanics would have had left to do would be to install the newly delivered part and put the tractor back together. This would not take more than 5 hours.
I wonder why his rental receipt was dated for THREE DAYS AFTER the part was delivered? Perhaps Keith should seek reimbursement from his mechanic. Keith is simply trying to terrorize me and extort money from me because he became enraged when I refused to take his verbal abuse or subject myself to his filthy language, and he saw my personal tragedy as an opportunity.
I offered to refund his money if he would ship back his parts freight collect. He refused and continued to threaten and harass me by email.in an attempt to stop the threats and harassment, I told him I would no longer correspond with him except to refund his money. Since then, he has harassed me, and threatened me and my business several times.
The more I refuse to be dragged into an email war, the worse his threats become. He has threatened me with the BBB, he has threatened to make sure I can't get state contracts for three years because he will continue to involve the BBB, he has told me that if I will sell him the parts at my cost, he will leave me alone, he emailed me with nothing in the email but an amount followed by a question mark, ($360.51?) then he emailed a threat to sue. This man is in such a rage he is unreasonable, and the rage is not about parts. It is because I refused to listen to his abuse. I wish I had the solution, but short of allowing myself and my business to be extorted, the solution escapes me.
07/22 BBB MORE INFO RECEIVED FROM THE BUSINESS: Business supplied email: [email protected]
Use this address for any contact with the Better Business Bureau
07/25 shir EMAIL Forward Business response to Consumer
07/26 WEB BBB RECEIVED CONSUMER REBUTTAL: (The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
Shelly Terrell, owner of Sundowner Tractor was well informed of what my situation was of having to coordinate the delivery of my parts with the repairshop and the time that they need to repair my tractor, part delivery time and railroad tie shipment.
Shelley has tried her best to put her lack of customer service onto removing herself from blame by first stating that I should no better than rely on accurate shipment information from the machanical/agricultural industry to it is the manufacturers fault, that she can't control what they do; and now trying to focus the blame onto the repair shop for not fixing the tractor in enough time to suit her. Meanwhile claiming no responsibility.
The bottom line is I was relying on her accurate information to schedule things appropropriately. She failed to give me accurate an/or timely information on where my parts were that I purchased from Sundowner Tractor, not the manufacturer, not anyone else. She would not give me access to the manufacturer of the parts in order to get the information that I needed on the status of my order and did not take my sense of urgency seriously.
The result of her lack of / and unwillingness to communicate in a proper fashion resulted in a loss of $360.51. When I tried to communicate with the owner of Sundowner. I was left, at first, with her lack of care of the situation. Whe I got more assertive to explain the sensitivity of my transaction with her company, I was confronted by owner with the facts that owner had let her personal life interfere with her business operations and took precedence over my needs from her business and I was dismissed.
When I further addressed the ramifications of her choice to allow her personal life to run her business has cost me. To that she only replied with a backlash wise answer. Which only offers that again she really doesn't care anything about how actions affect her customers and the only focus is recieving money from her customers with profit. I have politely asked this woman to stop attacking my character to which she has only escalated by now formally accused me of extortion. This action on sundowner is illegal. It is called Slander and Lible, which is prosecutable.
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