May 8: Received correctly addressed email from PayPal confirming that a $60 withdrawal from my bank will be deposited into my PayPal account. Immediately informed them it was unauthorized - I did NOT initiate such transaction, and was instructed to change my address, password, and security questions, and that they would commence an investigation.
Once the funds had cleared I wrote asking for an explanation what had happened and May 19 received the following response: Thank you for contacting PayPal. We apologize for the delay in responding to your service request. From researching your account history, I can see that your issue has been resolved (It has???). We are continually improving our customer service to accommodate members' needs (They are???) and can be contacted through secure webform for future inquiries by following these steps... If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact us again. Sincerely, PayPal Account Review Department PayPal, an eBay Company.
The same day I responded with: Thank you. However, the $60 was removed from my bank account. When does it get sent back? Michael.
May 20 produced the response as follows: Thanks for contacting PayPal. I appreciate the opportunity to assist you with your questions. To transfer money from your PayPal account to your bank account, please follow these steps... Please let me know if you need further assistance. Sincerely, Akbar.
I replied: Second request. Please advise who instigated the unauthorized withdrawal and what PayPal did to apprehend the culprit? Thank you.
May 22. Their response: Thank you for contacting PayPal. We appreciate your concern and have researched your account. At this time we are unable to disclose the guidelines that we use to monitor and/or further verify accounts. This information is not disclosed to protect the integrity of our service and community. (And the criminal too???) If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact us again. Sincerely, Jonathan.
My reply: Jonathan, An illegal attempt was made to steal money. You tell me you will not disclose who the culprit may be? Something is not right here. Explain why you are hiding the identity of the criminal, please?
May 23. Thank you for contacting PayPal. If you would like to obtain specific account information for another customer, we would need to be presented with a legal subpoena by an attorney or a law enforcement officer. This individual only, may leave a message at (650) 864-8345 to proceed with this process once the subpoena has been obtained. If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact us again. Sincerely, Kim.
Same day: Thank you Kim, I do have further questions. Am I to understand that because "another (PayPal) customer" committed this wrong, PayPal refuses to reveal the identity of the criminal? Isn't that tantamount to aiding and abetting? Surely this cannot be?"Specific account information" can remain completely protected; I only require contact particulars. And if PayPal still refuses to cooperate then why does it believe such a policy to be in the better interests of its honest customers? Doesn't PayPal pride itself in protecting their customers from fraud? Surely that cannot be to the exclusion of other customers? Just how can such a policy be overturned to where it actually shields criminal behavior? There's a definite conflict here, and judging from the position I see you taking, it can only promote, not deter, further abuse. I will be disgusted if this truly remains your position. Looking forward to your reply.
May25: Thanks for contacting PayPal. I appreciate the opportunity to assist you with your questions. While reviewing your PayPal account, we had noticed that your account activity suggests that another party had been accessing your PayPal account. For your own protection we had recommended that you create a new password. The majority of Unauthorized Access cases are a result of inadvertently providing sensitive account information on a 'fake' PayPal website or in response to a 'fake' PayPal email. It is also possible that if you have other accounts (email, eBay, etc.) that share the same password as your PayPal account, and one of those accounts are compromised, your PayPal account can be at risk of being
compromised as well. Remember these steps to help protect your PayPal account from Unauthorized Account Access... It is my pleasure to assist you. Thank you for choosing PayPal. Sincerely, Chyla.
My reply: You avoided answering none of my questions, Chyla, the situation calls for more than a simple canned response! Is or is not PayPal prepared to provide the answers which remain begging? The illegal attempt to syphon funds may have been done in a vacuum, but the resultant outcome will not. Thanks.
May 26. Thanks for contacting PayPal. I appreciate the opportunity to assist you with your questions. If you would like to obtain specific account information for another customer, we would need to be presented with a legal subpoena by an attorney or a law enforcement officer. Subpoenas relating to civil matters must be served or sent to our corporate headquarters at:
PayPal
Attn: Legal Dept./Civil
2211 North First Street
San Jose, CA 95131
Please note that we are unable to accept to civil subpoenas via electronic means at this time. If you are a law enforcement agency seeking records in relation to a criminal matter such as an investigation, you may contact our Law Enforcement hotline number at (408) 967-9919. Messaging regarding
instructions on how and where to serve your subpoena for the matter will
be provided at this number. Please let me know if you need further assistance. Sincerely, Dawn.
My response: Your prompt response is appreciated Dawn. However, as with the past requests for explanation, you also have neglected to address the questions posed. Thus, I will try for the fourth time. Let's forsake for the moment that I require the identity of the criminal party, OK? Read that twice. That said, let's then simply address your procedural requirements. Please explain in detail the reasoning behind your policy in situations such as this?
I will accept for the purpose of the present discussion that PayPal chooses to withhold "specific account information" so it then becomes a simple matter of explaining why, when you say you try to prevent fraud, that your very policy, in such cases as this, actually appears to encourage it? How can one reconcile this against the higher interests of decency, good judgment and justice? When PayPal shields the identity of one member who has tried to defraud another, isn't that aiding and betting? How can such a policy be proper? I really want to understand the true motive behind this. Please explain these things so that I and other interested members can at least have something more to chew on than simple and off-base canned responses. Give out a better response than your present "get a subpoena." attitude. One shouldn't require a subpoena to get policy explanation. Thank you.
May 27. What comes as no surprise: We appreciate your concern and have researched your account. At this time we are unable to disclose the guidelines that we use to monitor and/or further verify accounts. This information is not disclosed to protect the integrity of our service and community. We are also unable to release the status of another individual's account. If you have any further questions, please reply to this email. Sincerely, Lisa.
There you have it. Useless as tits on a bull. Hiding a fraudster because he/she's a PapPal member at the expense of an innocent PayPal member. Amazing? No, not really when one considers other questionable practices reported against PayPal.
Is it standard PayPal practice to withhold criminal evidence? Have others experienced this insulting behavior? Can anyone offer sensible suggestions? Doesn't this encourage more fraud rather than discourage it? The money was not intercepted by the crook, however the principle to do something to make PayPal accountable remains.
Mike
Kelwood, Manitoba
Canada
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