I will post this once again; here is the letter that I sent to the following agencies:
Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System
Division of Consumer and Community Affairs
20th and C Streets, NW, Stop 801
Washington, DC 20551
Federal Trade Commission
Consumer Response Center
600 Pennsylvania Ave., NW
Washington, DC 20580
Office of the Comptroller of the Currency
Customer Assistance Group
1301 McKinney Street
Suite 3450
Houston, TX 77010
I also sent a copy to the Senator of my State of residence
The reason that I took the time, and it does take time, to put together a well detailed and factual letter to the above agencies is because they have very limited time with which to investigate the numerous complaints of one kind or another that they receive. Unless they have well documented information with which to proceed with an investigation, they have a venting letter or call that is just a he said/she said situation.
One question I have, and maybe someone out there in web land can answer, is how Quicken derives at the up-front fee it charges each victim? In the hundreds of blogs I have read this fee ranges from $300 to $750 and everything in between. A credit report and appraisal for a large company is usually a pretty standard charge, so how does Quicken decide what it will collect up-front? Anyone out there have an answer?
Now on to the reason for this posting. My letter below outlines my experience with Quicken and is the letter I sent to the agencies above. You will find throughout my letter that I refer to Attachment A etc. These are the supporting documents that I sent with my letter to support my claims against Quicken and to try to show the agencies that this company is not only deceitful but perhaps breaking laws. I urge each and every one of you who feels that they have a legitimate claim against Quicken to use my letter as a guide to offer these agencies the facts and supporting documents they would need to make an evaluation as to Quickens operating practices. Use my letter as a guide.
If you terminated you dealings with Quicken prior to receiving much in the way of support documentation, and your money was taken, then do a written time line reconstructing the facts the best as you can. An example:
On (date & time) I called or submitted an email request to Quicken Loans
On (date & time) I received a call from (X) telling me (whatever)
This, again, is time consuming, but it gives an agency more factual information to go on.
Dear Board of Governors:
My husband and I purchased a home almost two years ago prior to the height of the downturn in the economy and more specifically the real estate market. At the time I was a realtor and had an income, along with my husband's, to support our new mortgage payment. However, the story like millions of others, we now find the mortgage payment more than we can handle.
Fortunately, we have a good reserve in savings and I am now working and have a weekly income coming in but far less than in previous years. So what do we do? In that we probably would be unable to sell our home at this time we thought that a refinance at a lower rate and paying off credit cards would put us back on track. Our credit scores are still excellent high 700's and we have a good cash reserve, but it is dwindling.By refinancing at a lower rate and paying off some credit cards, we would be in a more stable and manageable position financially. This is where my Quicken story begins.
I went on line and saw that "Quicken Loans" was offering a very good rate. This was on March 18. I filled out the online application and was subsequently contacted by a Mr. X who would become our Quicken Loans "mortgage banker". I was told by X that the rate reflected in Quicken's online add was just a "teaser" rate to attract interest and would not be available for us. However, he could still get us a very attractive rate providing we let him run a credit report and take our application by phone. I told him that I just wanted to know what rate they were offering and that I also wanted to check with Countrywide as we had had mortgages with them in the past. He did some fast talking and told me that Countrywide was in serious trouble and had laid off many employees and we would end up in a big mess if we used them. He also said Quicken had the best on going customer service as well as they would give us an automatic refinance should the rates continue to drop. He quoted me a rate of 5.85 %. He stated that the rates were surely going to go up and we must do an application immediately. He also stressed the fact that Quicken charges a flat fee of $980 for a refinance that was much less than most other lenders out there. We did a phone application providing him with all the information he needed to pre-qualify us even faxing him the information from our online accounts with our mortgage balance, tax and insurance premiums as well as a statement of our cash reserve. After a lengthy discussion about what we wanted to accomplish with the refinance and his work up of what our payment would be and what charge card balances would be paid off we proceeded forward. Upon his initial review of our information he told us what the rate would be which was acceptable to us and that based on the initial information he had at that point, this would be a "slam dunk" loan but he immediately needed an upfront fee of $500.00 charged on our charge card to start the process and that would be credited to us at closing. All of this took place the evening of March 19 as well as the fee of $500 we paid with our Visa card. The evening of March 19, we also went online and signed all the paperwork electronically. The morning of March 20, I received a call from Mr. X who informed me that the rate of 5.85 % was now 5.99%. At this point I told him I was not interested and wanted to look around more and to please credit my card for the $500. Well a little while later I received another call and he told me that wow the rates went down a little and I locked you in at the 5.85%. However there was now a. 25% point we would have to pay. I told him I was really uncomfortable with all the misinformation and wanted to around. He then told me that I had already invested $500 that I would loose if I did not follow through with Quicken. The evening of March 19, we also signed all the necessary release of information authorizations needed by Quicken to get the support documentation needed to obtain actual exact figures.
Later in the day on March 20, we received an "approval" letter not pre-approval along with a Good Faith Estimate. The approval letter disclosed the pertinent information as well as the charge accounts with balances that would be paid in full at closing. (Attachment A). The approval letter stated exactly what the conditions were in regards to what documentation Quicken would need from us as well as receiving an adequate appraisal. All the information requested was faxed to Mr. X on March 20. (Attachment B) On March 21 we received a call from Mr. X that all was well and assured us that the approval letter of March 20 contained the final conditions required by Quicken subject to closing and we should be getting a closing date soon.
On March 24, we received a call from Mr. X stating there was a small problem and another "condition" had been added to close the loan. He told us we must make two additional car payments immediately to pay down the length of the car note. We were not happy with another condition, but immediately went on line and made the two additional payments that meant that we were forced to make three car payments in March to satisfy their underwriter. We were very unhappy with this latest and greatest condition, however he assured us that this would be the last condition to get to closing. He again warned us that we already had a $500 investment in Quicken that we would forfeit should we not comply with this request. He again assured us that this was the last "condition" in order to close. (Attachment C) After each newly added condition and our mounting fear and anger, Mr. X would remind us that should we not comply with their requests, we would forfeit our $500. He would then feed us the same line this is the last condition, hang in there, lets get to settlement.
On March 25, we received a call from Ms. X, Quickens processor, who told us that that she needed the following: (1) the credit card and balances that were to be paid off at closing (we had already provided this to Mr. X and was clearly shown in Quickens approval to us dated March 20. (Attachment A) (2) Schedule E 2006 tax return, (3) Our sons bank statements showing his payments of his car note that we were co-signers of, as this had suddenly become an issue to our debt ratio but had clearly been disclosed upon our initial application (4) Declaration of our homeowners insurance. (Attachment D) These documents were faxed to Ms. X at 7:05 pm on March 25. (Attachment D) Mr. X once again, assured us that we would be getting a closing date, probably April 15, but he would confirm in a day or so.
The next day, March 26, we did get a call from Mr. X, however, it was not to schedule a closing date. There was another small problem and another condition had been added. I will diverse a bit here by going back to our phone application with Mr. X on March 19.in addition to the home we reside in, we also have a rental property. This was discussed in dept with Mr. X. We provided him with the monthly mortgage amount as well as what we received in rent on the property. We have a very good tenant and a legitimate lease with this tenant. Mr. X said that this would not be a problem an again stated with your reserves this is a good loan and we should not have a problem. However, when Mr. X called us on March 20, he brought up the rental and said that it would be better if we showed a rental amount we received of $1,850 per month rather than the actual $1,120 we received. I was very concerned and upset at this request and after some thought called him back and said if this was now going to be a problem I wanted a refund of my $500 and I would look elsewhere for a loan. I asked him how he thought I could prove that I received more rent then we actually got if Quicken then asked for proof. Mr. X assured me that all they wanted was alease showing $1,850, and that was it. He had never seen Quicken ask for more proof in his tenure with Quicken or as he stated any other mortgage company he had been with. I informed Mr. X that I did not want the loan if I had to falsify figures. He said he would get back to me.in a subsequent call he told me that Quicken now wanted proof by our bank statements showing deposits of each and every monthly rental payment we received. However, all was well and it was not going to be a problem. I will also interject here that whenever I called Mr. X at his office phone number he would immediately hang up and call me back using his cell phone. I found this very odd. During this same call I told Mr. X that I was now employed, part-time status, in a field that I had prior experience, and why not just add my income. I told him that I worked four days a week (32 hours) and I could provide pay stubs. Mr. X told me that he would call me the next day to let me know if this would be possible. The following day I did receive a call from him but unfortunately the mortgage guideline, which he claimed were changing daily, did not allow part-time income to be used. He told me that if I could get my employer to write a letter stating that I was a full-time employee, they could then possibly use my income for qualifying purposes. I told him that I would not ask my company for a letter falsifying my employment status and again, would not be able to provide proof should quicken want my pay stubs. I was again assured by Mr. X this would not be a problem, however, I declined his request. Again, this conversation took place on his cell phone. I was, once again, assured that we would be going to closing and to hang in there.
Well closing did not happen, and on April 8, we then received yet another "condition". We must provide Quicken with a 2007 tax return. As I had explained to Mr. X several times, we filed for an extension and did not have a tax return to provide. We were informed by Mr. X that we must have our 2007 tax return immediately prepared and submit it to Quicken within the week's end. (Attachments E) Again, this was more money we had to spend out of our pocket to have our tax person prepare the newly requested tax info. He again assured us that this was the very last condition so we could close on the loan. He sent us an email instructing us as to which pages of the tax return were requested and what figures it must show. (Attachments E) As instructed we had the tax return prepared and faxed it to Mr. X on April 10. (Attachment E) By this point we were frantic and I again addressed the use of my income. Mr. X told me that use of my income would could not be counted or used based on the changing guidelines.
The next day, April 11, we received a call from Mr. X stating that he had made a "mistake" and that he did not need the pages of the tax return he had requested of us by email but just page 1 of schedule "E". We again called our tax preparer and immediately faxed Quicken the information requested.
Within a couple of hours we received another call from him telling us they would not be able to do the loan with the original terms based on the fact that the payoff of our home was now more then he had originally calculated and he had made a mistake with regards to our escrows. A good news/bad news email followed and is attached. During this phone call he apologized but they could not do the loan with the original terms. Please bear in mind that on March 20, we had provided written proof with the proper documents of all escrow and payoff amounts. I asked him what in the world he was taking about as he had this information since March 20? Mr. X stated that Quicken could still (possibly) do a refinance but with completely different terms than the original terms for which we applied, provided documentation and conditions to each and every request and which would put us in a more stable financial position. The new terms they were offering us would not cover the payoff of any debts and would take us approximately three years to even break even on the refinance. I asked Mr. X other than Quicken making more money off us for this great loan, what was the benefit to us? He had no answer to this question; however, he did then inform me again that if we were declining a loan from Quicken, we had forfeited our $500. I informed Mr. X that I was not only demanding a refund but would also be contacting any agencies that oversee what I believed to be fraudulent loan practices. I also reminded him again, that I was declining completely altered and changed loan from which I had applied for almost a month ago.
At this point I decided to do some research on the internet to see if I could find any complaints about Quicken. To my horror, I found hundreds of complaints of the same nature even down to the mortgage bankers only speaking with customers by means of their "cell" phones.in addition, I also found numerous complaints from former Quicken mortgage bankers that shed light on the use of their cell phones rather than office land lines as well as the pressure they were put under to immediately get a charge card number on every inquiry. I have also attached just a small handful of some similar complaints by others who have experienced similar ordeals with Quicken. I wonder, among other things, if this constitutes a clear example of bait and switch?
Sincerely,
Anywhere USA
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